Your take on "movie" bodyguards?

[Local Talent]

[Maybe this will get some participation:]

There's precious few movies dealing specifically with executive protection. I loved In the Line of Fire, but just as in The Sentinel (so-so flick, but good extras on the DVD, BTW), we're talking USSS there, a whole other playing field.
So the movie of reference, when it comes to our job and for better or for worse, is The Bodyguard with Kevin Costner (1992).

Although I have serious issues with it, I think that the movie did a fair job, besides its entertainment value, of exposing the masses to our world. I often use it to illustrate a point. The stereotypical characters Tony and Sy, celebrity bodyguard and publicist (respectively), are right on the money, IME.

My main pb with the story may be that after Farmer crosses the line and sleeps with his client (already a big enough mistake), he still tries to keep working for her afterwards. :rolleyes:
And the scene where Farmer leaves his protectees behind to chase a bad guy in the night and shoots eyes closed is just Hollywood BS, too.
Also, Farmer carries his Browning chamber empty, can't keep his finger off the trigger, and even points his gun at one of the female characters' face to reinforce a point that she should "stay there"... :eek:

I'm sure you've all seen it, so why don't you tell us your observations? Gear, gun handling, tactics, agent-client-staff interactions... a lot of meat in there.

And if I missed other movies/series, feel free to bring 'em up.

Oh, and there's a poll, too... :) (I voted #4)

[Dykhofft]

I am going to have to agree with you that there were certain parts of that movie that were BS. With all movies you have to be able to take it with a grain of salt and say good try. The film makers make these movies for the people that have no idea about the field they are trying to show. I guess with our knowledge of the EP/PSD field we can pick out things easier. But then you have Young Gun Rambo sitting at home about to graduate highschool and next thing you know he wants to be a bodyguard because he thinks the movie is 100% accurate.

[Local Talent]

Yep. I give the movie credit for exposing the difficulties we have in doing our job.
Egotistic clients surrounded by enablers and moochers, with no clue whatsoever about how to achieve security? Check.
Rebellious clients who think that giving their bodyguard a hard time is a fun sport? Check.
Flirtatious clients (or staff) who make it very hard for you to keep your job? Check.

And having never reached the character's level, I always marvel at how Farmer tells his client how much he'll be paid, or walks out of a meeting because "I can't protect you like that". IME, I've quit or requested transfers when I couldn't take a client's antics anymore, but usually kept my mouth shut so as not to sound like an ungrateful SOB or a trouble maker (I've always worked for a company, even if subcontacting, so far).

[Local Talent]

One decent and recent depiction of the job is the first few minutes of The Transporter 2, when we see Jason Statham's character pick up his clients' kid from school, then take him to the doc's office. Although IME, the ride would be provided by the client (I've had to use my own vehicle once to chauffeur a VIP, but the company wasn't happy and ended up talking to the client).
Of course the movie veers into complete fantasy soon after. :(

And back to The Bodyguard, the scenes when Farmer foils an AOP in a parking lot and later carries his client off-stage in his arms make little sense in the real world and have obviously been put in for dramatic effect.
Knowing that his first client was at risk, walking him to a car in a dark and deserted parking lot where an ambush was likely was not sound. As for wading through a rowdy crowd alone with a woman in one's arms, it sure makes for a good poster, but doesn't seem too realistic either.

I still get a kick everytime I watch that scene when Farmer enters and tests Rachel's (Whitney Houston) residence for the first time (beat-up intercom, complacent staff, etc.). Right on the money from what I've seen... :thumbs:

[Local Talent]

Now 5 posts out of 4 in my own thread... Yikes! You guys don't watch too many movies, do ya?

One movie that surprised me (I had low expectations about it), although it's not a serious one, is Guarding Tess. The difficult client (a first lady in that case) who gives her protectors such a hard time that no one wants to work for her - that reminded me of a few real world situations...

I especially enjoyed how the movie started with Nic Cage's character blowing a fuse over being requested again for protective duty: sometimes, doing a great job doesn't mean you're quite enjoying yourself... ;)
Worth renting as a study on how clients don't always view us as guardian angels. :)

[Lone Wolf]

In reference to all the movies you guys have named you are right.. Close??? No Cigar... While they are very entertaining to a point, I dont think that they do our profession any good.. The action the antics.. yeah ok...

The one movie that I have seen that I just cant seem to watch enough is:

MAN ON FIRE It was to a point realistic and yet there were alot of aspects that I dont think that any of us would really do or even think of doing... It was very entertaining though and the end.. Well if you havent seen it you should.

[Local Talent]

Yeah, movies are usually not to be taken seriously, esp. about something as little known/understood as our job.

I caught Man on Fire on TV once, and although he's a great actor, I'm not a big fan of Denzel, so I didn't pay as much attention to that movie as to the others discussed.
Like Proof of Life, it deals with aspects related to EP that I'm not very familiar with (overseas kidnappings, hostage rescue, etc.). And it takes the idea of the protector to the extreme...

As silly as the movies/TV depictions can be, it's good to keep in mind that they probably shape the perception of most outsiders we come in contact with (including our clients), so we can't ignore them altogether. I remember having a discussion with a female Asian client when The Transporter came out (I'm a bald white guy).

Thanks again for participating, Wolf!

[panjkraz]

The one movie that I have seen that I just cant seem to watch enough is:

MAN ON FIRE It was to a point realistic and yet there were alot of aspects that I dont think that any of us would really do or even think of doing... It was very entertaining though and the end.. Well if you havent seen it you should.

8 stars!
As realistic as the present AGNA fiasco or contractors gone wild with a doublecross feature. A new group called CSS Global appears to be doing some hiring for Somalia but as tough as I am and no backup (lack of stable military presence), I passed on that one because I would to be a going to a gunfight (RPGs, suicide bombers, Kalashnikov/Dragunov, etc) with a knife (under armed i.e.perhaps M4/M16) with some documented problems experienced with the Kunar province gunfight some weeks ago in Afghanistan.

[Local Talent]

I dont think that they do our profession any good..
Actually, Kevin Costner says in the DVD extras that he's been approached by bodyguards who thanked him for his portrayal. Before that movie, with all its shortcomings, you gotta figure that very little had been shown about us.
When you tell the average person that you're an executive protection specialist, they go, "Huh?". But if you say bodyguard, they immediately see Costner's face and you get another reaction.

Again, I'm no big fan of the movie but it did portray us as smart, professional, modern day white knights, instead of thugs or bullet-catchers.

If I had a $ for every time someone said to me, "You don't look like a bodyguard!", like Rachel (Whitney Houston) tells Farmer (Costner) in the beginning...

[Lone Wolf]

Oh yeah I totally get it.. When you tell people that you are in EP / Bodyguard work yeah they look at you like WOW.. To us its no big deal it is what we do, just like they go to the office very day we do our things as well...

[Local Talent]

"It is what it is and we do what we have to do to keep ourselves employed happy and healthy for the most part..."
The "healthy" part of that Lone Wolf quote from another thread just reminded me of one of the first scenes in Bullitt: a mob informant in SFPD protective custody in a safe house unlocks a door without the knowledge of the officers babysitting him... Soon, hitmen enter and blast everybody in the room with shotguns.

How many times did a client unlock a door you had locked or refused to wait when you asked them to? Sometimes it feels like being stuck in a lifeboat with a crazy person who keeps stabbing it whenever you're not looking... :eek:

[Lone Wolf]

Thats for sure....

[SCBA Admin]

Ive known a few agents over the years who have crossed the "line" with female clients... most of them were instigated by the agent, which all resulted in an immediate termination, and the rare one that was initiated by the client, was a short 5 month trist, that actually ended as both of them being friends, but realized it wouldnt have worked out and subsquently ended on good terms.

As for the bodyguard movie, Ive met Mr. Costner a few times, my brother in law is a full working actor and starred in Dances with Wolves, field of dreams, and more... I know Kevin worked with several bodyguards in LA and trained with the secret service when he was preparing for his role in "The Bodyguard" and understand, as much as he learned to do things correctly, he still had to act in a hollywood movie, and had to follow the script/director/producer etc... he said several things were contrived for the sake of the story.

But boy didnt Whitney Houston's career tank after that... wow.

[Lone Wolf]

Yes it did..

[Local Talent]

I know Kevin worked with several bodyguards in LA and trained with the secret service when he was preparing for his role in "The Bodyguard" and understand, as much as he learned to do things correctly, he still had to act in a hollywood movie, and had to follow the script/director/producer etc... he said several things were contrived for the sake of the story.
True. I got into quite a few online movie discussions where everybody loves to point out gun or tactics mistakes, but sometimes there's no way to tell a story in 2 hours w/o taking a few liberties.
Again, Costner carrying Houston off-stage and parting the crowd may not have made much tactical sense, but for the audience and the public it created a powerful image.

As an aside, I got to meet Costner (not personally) on the job, and he seems to be one of Hollywood's few genuine nice guys. I think that The Bodyguard, warts and all, at least sent the right message about us.

Ive known a few agents over the years who have crossed the "line" with female clients...
I saw that once (not my detail, although the agent had worked with me before). Some female protectees are fascinated by us "strong men" willing to die for them (see Whitney's lines about that in The Bodyguard), and I think it's a lousy (and stupid) thing to do to take advantage of the situation.

[Lone Wolf]

HMMM I hate to disappoint anyone but I wont die for anyone nor will I take a bullet for them.. Bottom line is if I take one for the protectee then who will protect him / her if Im down??? Who gets the next one???

[Local Talent]

[...] I wont die for anyone [...]
Anyone? Really?

Then, since the advent of body armor, we don't necessarily have to die anymore. I often joke with people that they can take cover behind me when bullets start flying: I may not be big, but I doubt most rounds will go through 2 panels and my little meat... :)

Now when I don't want anybody around, I tell them that my spot is where bullets will be landing so it's not a good idea to crowd me. Funny how people clear my airspace after that. :D

ETA: More on how movies have to take some license... At one point in The Bodyguard, we see Farmer come home and have to push aside with his foot a mountain of old mail sitting on his doormat. We all know that we'd have taken steps (forwarding to a mailing service, arranging a friend or neighbor pick-up, etc.) to avoid having mail stolen or signaling an empty house to potential burglars.
But from the filmmaker's perspective, it was a very economical and effective way to show the lonely life of a bodyguard who spends little time at home, and has no one waiting for him there.

[Lone Wolf]

Nope LT I wont take one for the team.. Not like that anyway... There are so many different types of bullets out there now days, I dont even really trust my vest anymore... I was watching the History channel yesterday and they has a think on there about Dragon Skin and other types of vests.. Vests are just bullet resistant to a point.. once that point is crossed then all bets are off... A bullet will slice throught it just like your not wearing one... Then main thing is to ALWAYS BE ALERT and never let your guard down..

I was reading my latest edition of Guns and Weapons.. I will post some information from that magazine shortly...

The topic was Survival...

[Local Talent]

Oh yeah, even if the vest was actually bulletproof you could get hit somewhere not covered, or get injured or killed from the trauma. I don't want to get shot period, vest or not - it doesn't turn you into superman. Armor does make things a little safer though.

What I was trying to say is: I think there's things or people worth dying for.
I hear a lot of guys say, "Oh, I wouldn't risk my life for so little money". My question is then, "For how much would you? Isn't your life priceless?"
A soldier doesn't pack up the first time he (or she) takes incoming fire. Well, some did say they hadn't signed "for this" and were in it for the free college... and I have no respect for them. No, a soldier knows he could die because of the decision he made to go defend his country, and he still does the job, regardless of the lousy pay.

Well, I view EP the same way. We may or may not like/respect the clients, but it should make no difference. They should know that we'll stand in front of them simply because we took the job.
There's limits to that, of course: I wouldn't personally go to jail to protect a client involved in criminal activities, for ex. And if someone hired me then went around starting fights that he'd expect me to finish, you bet we'd have a talk. But if I take the job and their money, I should step up when time comes.

Now in all honesty, that extreme situation never presented itself for me, thank God. Maybe I'd fold, who knows?
But in truth, when you see something suspicious or suspect trouble ahead, don't you instinctively place your body in front of your protectee(s)? Aren't you ready to do the fighting for them? (And yes, I realize that we cover & evacuate, not stand & deliver, but there's still the notion that we are the shield).
I'm sure you do, and that's what I meant by take a bullet. You're not going to see the tracer coming and jump in front of the guy to eat it, like in the movies. But if you're doing your job it will be your meat that gets tenderized, not theirs.

I you don't feel that way (I've heard guys say they wouldn't lift a finger to help a client), I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

[Lone Wolf]

LT you are right.. I have placed my life on the line on numerous occasions and frequently willing or not... You are correct... There are some things worth placing your life in jeopardy for.. Patriotism... The military does it every day, as did I when I was active duty... Who knows.. There is always a price where someone will do that very thing... I mean Im even considering going overseas for work just because work here stateside is a bust right now... YUP your right LT...

[Local Talent]

I know that not everybody feels that way, but knowing you to be old-school, patriotic, and a former soldier... I figured that we had to be on the same page. :)

You were probably thinking of that image of the bodyguard jumping to intercept a bullet meant for his client, like Eastwood does in In the Line of Fire...
I don't see myself quite doing that either, in part because physics kinda make that move about as impossible as curving bullet paths a la Angelina Jolie in Wanted!

[Local Talent]

But if you're doing your job it will be your meat that gets tenderized, not theirs.
In the interest of being educational to our members still new to this or sitting on the fence, if we're doing our job successfully, NO ONE will get hurt, of course. If we come under attack, either we're dealing with a desperate/suicidal individual (against whom there is little protection) or we've somehow failed.
But we all know what happens to the best plans, so we have to be mentally prepared and trained for the worst.
Murphy knows where we work... :(

[Local Talent]

Watching The Way of the Gun on DVD again. Pretty good quirky B-movie with a lot of gunplay. In the first few minutes, 2 bodyguards make the same huge mistake twice in a row by turning away from their principal to engage the bad guys. The result is a kidnapping. A good illustration of how we should always keep an eye on the ball.

ETA: and shame on me for not noticing right away that their suit jackets stay buttoned up during the whole movie. They do look spiffy, though. ;)