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Geo
07-02-2010, 07:29 AM
Are There Holes in Your Training Resumé?
By Marty Hayes, J.D.
Posted: June 4, 2010


A person needs to attend formal firearms training courses for at least one, if not two, very good reasons. The first reason is, of course, to learn how to use the firearm safely and competently for self-defense. This necessitates a critical look at your lifestyle and priorities, and examining where your skills are lacking. Do you live in a crime-infested urban environment, where bars on your windows are practically mandated, or do you live in a rural area, where your German Shepherd will alert you to any approaching hominoids? In these diametrically opposed circumstances, the skills and layers of protection you need to employ are not the same, although in each case, there are definite security issues.

Start Young
Skill at arms can come outside of formal training. Many people rely upon past military training as their basis for knowing how to shoot, while others rely upon competition to sharpen their self-defense skills. Additionally, many people were taught as youngsters how to shoot firearms, and in my opinion, this is where a young boy or girl’s initial training should occur.

I happen to be married to a lady whose father felt it was necessary to teach his two daughters how to use that .22 rifle he kept by the back door of the farmhouse. What a pleasure it was for me as an instructor to begin teaching her how to use a handgun for self-defense, as she didn’t have to fight through a fog of mixed brainwaves to learn the lessons she was being taught. There was no fear of guns, nor any moral re-programming necessary for her to understand that it was okay to use deadly force if threatened with the same. Her father (a God-fearing man) had taught her that before she was a teenager.

Train To Gain Confidence
Even if you have acquired the ability to shoot guns safely and competently, you must also examine how confident you feel in your role as your own number one protector. Do you feel confident in your skills and abilities? Do you find yourself fearful at times, even though you have your concealed carry handgun with you? If so, take it from a guy who has devoted most of his working adult life to helping people gain this confidence: Get some training.

There has never been a better time in America’s history to find good trainers. There are hundreds, if not thousands, of folks teaching their fellow armed citizens how to use guns for self-defense.
But what type of training should you seek out? There has never been a better time in America’s history to find good trainers. There are hundreds, if not thousands, of folks teaching their fellow armed citizens how to use guns for self-defense. If your budget permits, you can get any type of training you want. Plus, training is fun. Yep, just like golfing and motorcycle riding. It really is fun to learn how to use a firearm skillfully. One of the greatest pleasures in my life is seeing the confidence build in people who were once, even hours before, apprehensive and fearful.

Legalities of Self-Defense
What does all this have to do with the legalities of self-defense? To answer that, you must put yourself in the shoes of a typical juror, deciding if the defendant on trial used a reasonable degree of force in self-defense. This takes us into the second reason for attending training courses, that being to document your knowledge of self-defense law and if you were capable of assessing whether or not your life was in danger. I cannot stress enough how critical it is for the armed citizen to be able to tell a jury, in their own words, the type of training they have received, and why they acted the way they did in that particular situation. When analyzing a claim of self-defense, a jury should be able to look at the incident through the defendant’s eyes, seeing everything the defendant saw and knowing everything the defendant knew.

In other words, you have the right, in open court, to let the jury know what was going through your mind at the time you pulled the trigger. You have the right to explain what you saw, what you heard, and what you were feeling at the time you pulled the trigger. You also have the right to educate the jury as to what you knew about self-defense considerations, within certain bounds.

Document Your Knowledge
The first limiting factor is: Can you document your knowledge? How do you know that a person who is half a dozen steps away from you and armed with a contact weapon already possesses the ability and opportunity to kill you, if he so chooses? The ability to document your knowledge of the Tueller Drill (sometimes erroneously referred to as the “21 foot rule”) is vital to your being able to introduce this into court.

There is a saying in the legal arena: “If it isn’t documented, it didn’t occur.” What that means for the armed citizen is that if you cannot show the judge that you were trained or otherwise cognizant of the premise behind the Tueller Drill, you likely will not have an opportunity to testify to that. You show this through your training resumé, including notes, written material and videos that were presented in class.

The other boundary that a judge might put in the way of your testifying as to what you knew is making sure that any tenets of law are discussed by the judge and attorneys, not the defendant or witnesses. I once testified in a case where the judge disallowed a training manual to be admitted into evidence because it contained explanations of the law. I believe that training manual was critical to the defense, but it didn’t get in. An appealable point, for sure, and I hope the lady who was convicted and is now in prison brings it up on appeal!

Presentation to the Jury
Another question you must ask yourself regarding your training resumé is, how will this play to a jury? If the training courses you have attended all fall under the “Warrior Prince” label, and contain course descriptions that would make the average person wonder if John Rambo is sitting in front of them, I submit you have a problem. You and I know that most course descriptions are designed primarily for marketing reasons and not courtroom defense. But if all you can show a jury is that your training consisted of classes on how to efficiently kill your fellow human beings, and is deficient in showing that you also took considerable time, energy and money to learn when and under what circumstances deadly force is warranted, then I know you have a problem.

Don’t let holes in your training resumé turn what should be a relatively straightforward case of self-defense into a prosecution and conviction. Balance your training in how to kill with legal and moral training regarding that decision. You will be glad you did, and you might just learn a thing or two in the process!


The eyes the jury should be viewing the evidence through should be your eyes

Local Talent
07-02-2010, 08:45 AM
Good article, thanks for posting it, Geo. It reinforces the point we've often made here that training is liability protection.

Some claim that being overly trained can make you appear as a "Rambo", as the author notes, or open you to (ignorant) questions such as, "why didn't you shoot the gun off his hand, if you're such an expert?". But since we're in a profession where the use of force is likely, and likely to make us end up in court, I think that we have all justification, and even an obligation, to gain and show proficiency. It is irresponsible to be armed and ignorant of the issues brought up by the author (legality and marksmanship), for example, and that would bring us claims of negligence for sure.

The part that worries me is this:
The other boundary that a judge might put in the way of your testifying as to what you knew is making sure that any tenets of law are discussed by the judge and attorneys, not the defendant or witnesses. I once testified in a case where the judge disallowed a training manual to be admitted into evidence because it contained explanations of the law. I believe that training manual was critical to the defense, but it didn’t get in. An appealable point, for sure, and I hope the lady who was convicted and is now in prison brings it up on appeal!
Because I know from experience that having one's day in court and being authorized to defend oneself properly are two different things. It would be nice if we could (or could have our attorney) explain the rationale behind our every move, word, or gear choice, but that may not happen, I'm afraid.

I'm sure we all know otherwise that training is also vital to be able to face the music on the job, as well as to get jobs in the first place (resume building). :)

Local Talent
07-02-2010, 10:10 AM
I was just reading this: http://ezine.m1911.org/showthread.php?t=41 when I found that:

"MAS emphasizes that one has used force in self defense, the question of whether that use of force was justified will be decided from the perspective of "the reasonable and prudent person in the exact situation and knowing what you know." He stresses the need to be able to articulate how and why you concluded that you needed to use force to defend yourself and the knowledge that you had acquired from training and experience upon which your conclusion was based.

One thing he recommends is that whenever taking training, take good notes. A few weeks after the class, type them up and mail a copy to yourself, certified mail. Don't open the envelop when it arrives, but keep in a safe deposit box or in some other secure way. These notes, when appropriately opened will establish that you knew certain things from your training and when you knew them. The USPS certified mail date stamps provides incontrovertible evidence that the notes were created before that date."

Ayoob takes things even a step further! Seriously, I wonder who does that.

Hoping for the best is not what we do (we prepare for the worst, right?), but sometimes reality is far from ideal. We know that if we have to mount a defense after what Geo called a "critical incident" in another thread, instructors and training records can be subpoenaed.
Well, my current BSIS /point shooting instructor is old enough that I worry that he won't be around when I need him (I hope he's not reading this!), my baton instructor gave me the card but apparently failed to file with the BSIS since my permit never showed online (he didn't respond when I asked him why), and one shooting school failed to issue me the diploma at graduation (no response there either)...

So I train to be trained, but am fully prepared not to be allowed to present in court an evidence that won't exist anyway. :eek:
I hope you guys are doing better and this post by Geo should give all of us something to think about...

Geo
07-02-2010, 12:45 PM
That is why I pay a private attorney a yearly retainer for off duty incidents.....Due to the liability I feel a lot better and it is money well spent...

Local Talent
07-02-2010, 01:00 PM
I hear ya. Another advantage LEOs have over the rest of us is the amount of training, all easily documented and of unassaillably professional standards, they receive throughout their career. No wonder their credibility is such in court and they are such an easy "sell" to clients for EP services.

SonnyPI
07-02-2010, 02:00 PM
I hear ya. Another advantage LEOs have over the rest of us is the amount of training, all easily documented and of unassaillably professional standards, they receive throughout their career. No wonder their credibility is such in court and they are such an easy "sell" to clients for EP services.

Caution here:
Although LE may have many years of experience on the job, they may have zero experience or training in EP. And although possibly an easier sell, the client may have a false expection and less than adequate result. A gynecologist and neurosurgeon are both medical doctors [MD], but I wouldn't want a gyno pocking around in my brain housing group given the choice.
Further they may have limited documented training in regard to use of deadly force, or DE-escalation of force outside of POST/ academy training depending upon their respective departments.
We all know 20 year LE veterans that have not ever removed their sidearm from their holster or actually fired it other than periodic qualifying on the range.
EP is a specialized art in military, LE and civilian sectors.
With respect to all in their respective fields.
Cordially, Sonny

Local Talent
07-02-2010, 03:10 PM
Well, of course, Sonny, you're right and we've discussed this many times. There's even more downsides to LEOs going into EP that I won't get into here. And there's LEO and LEO, too...

But within the scope of this thread, it's hard to argue that their knowledge of the law, of the use of force issues, and of court testimony, are invaluable if one is concerned with liability (and who isn't? Most of what we actually do in private security has to do with liability).
So just like folks from the military have often been battle-tested, which A LOT of guys in private security never have, cops are thought of as known quantities (for better or for worse, I'm adding for you! :)).

It's clear that some with a badge or a DD214 aren't worth much and have been hiding throughout their career, or that they haven't been prepared at all for protective work, but that's obviously not what I was referring to. And I don't think that the author was addressing EP training per se.

Geo
07-02-2010, 03:48 PM
I agree with the above post in many respects. Many may know this about post certs. But for those who don't let me give a brief synopsis. Post cert in Ca represents the minimum standards and qualifications for police in the state. It starts out with the basic cert and continues up the chain. For those who want to get their advanced certs, you need upper college education or time on the job. Basically what I am saying here that post is built for lowest common denominator in Le. But for many of us who are sworn, we take it upon ourselves to seek out various types training. Many of us have diverse backgrounds and training including military. Many of us have set foot on foreign soil and not in the motor pool....As far use of force stuff, I can only speak of my department. We do receive 2x yearly training on deadly force which equals to about 20 hours. On the de-escalation side, we get it every 6 months. Again another 20 hours. The department keeps computerized records on departmental training as well as anything you pay for off duty. So when your are sued it is pretty easy to get what you need. All military training, units and service you gave the dept will also be on there. With all the budget cuts, the past 18 months most of the training has been off duty. The dept is meeting the minimums. Let me also address that many of my fellow military personal also give clients a false sense of security. They too may have zero training, experience or patience to work in the states on the ep side of things. As Sonny addressed up top, let me address here. A 5th group guy and a civil affairs guy are both considered soldiers. But I know if I was client who I would want doing advances for me. I think that having a verifiable honest resume is the only way to be. We all have see those who have inflated egos that bs on things. But the great thing is thanks to the internet. We for the most part can check up on most anything. Plus the spec op community is small so when a guy says he was with SEAL TEAM 6. It is easy to blow that one out of the water...As with Sonny, much respect to all you fellas on your past, present and future resume.. All the best.. Geo

Local Talent
07-02-2010, 05:09 PM
Yeah, verifiable creds are a whole 'nother can o' worms!
One thing's for sure: I would never claim to be a SPECOPS guy if I weren't. Besides resources like http://www.veriseal.org/, the EP community is small and one will be eventually called on one's BS, and it won't be pleasant... :copstick:

I have to say that, putting aside all the guys that are POST certified but work in security, the tech or honorary reserves, and other campus cops (and no offense meant to any of these), the training resumes of all the CA LEOs I ever met were impressive.

IME it's also true that the HSLD types I've ran into had little interest in the domestic EP work and they didn't last on the details I've been on. Now would I want them besides me when the SHTF? Hell yeah.

SonnyPI
07-02-2010, 05:14 PM
Copy all Geo & LT.
Cordially, Sonny

Lone Wolf
07-06-2010, 03:28 PM
Great Points GEO... As you stated I rely on both.. Military and competative shooting to keep the skills sharp sharp sharp.. Learn, Re-learn and learn again.. Learn something each and every new adventure... I attempt to learn something every trip to the range or competative shooting contest... I am an NRA LE Handgun / Shotgun Instructor, and learning is on the agenda daily...